I think this is a dangerous line of thinking, there’s always room for an improvement, and little aerodynamic improvements can have huge efficiency savings.
Drag coeff is gonna be hard to improve, but I think it could get significantly better by ditching the classic car shape, I wish manufacturers were willing to experiment more.
Especially the front area, which used to hold engines, and the inefficient hatchback shape.
Cross sectional area can be improved by changing how space is used. Frontal area is more costly to use that length, so so smarter use of say where batteries are relative to feet, can give the feel of more depth while not adding to the frontal area.
I agree, there can still be improvements in many areas. I would say ditch this whole discussion and argue that personal vehicles shouldn’t be the primary option and the focus should be on more efficient and effective public transport instead. But on the personal vehicle side, the practical first step is phasing out ICE vehicles, which brings a huge overall improvement to transport efficiency as it stands. The second step would then be making the least efficient EVs more efficient. EV development and design can still progress during that time, but millions of km of roadway is constructed based on this standard shape of vehicle. If you want more efficient than the I6 and M3, I’d say get an electric motorcycle.
But on the personal vehicle side, the practical first step is phasing out ICE vehicles, which brings a huge overall improvement to transport efficiency as it stands.
I don’t like this line of thinking because the resources required to replace every car we have with an electric one (and if things continue as is, they’ll also be bigger). We need to have way fewer cars. Our personal vehicles should be in the shape of bicycles.
…which is why I said we should “ditch this whole discussion and argue that personal vehicles shouldn’t be the primary option and the focus should be on more efficient and effective public transport instead.”
Unfortunately, much of North America was developed to be reliant on personal vehicles. I love to bike when I can, but development needs to change to make it a practical form of transport for most trips.
I wasn’t sure where you were going with the “I would say…” part, so I thought it was worth saying.
And to that I would point out that much of North America was redeveloped for the car, since most cities were once walkable and had great public transport networks. It was redeveloped once so it can be redeveloped again.
I think this is a dangerous line of thinking, there’s always room for an improvement, and little aerodynamic improvements can have huge efficiency savings.
Drag coeff is gonna be hard to improve, but I think it could get significantly better by ditching the classic car shape, I wish manufacturers were willing to experiment more.
Especially the front area, which used to hold engines, and the inefficient hatchback shape.
Cross sectional area can be improved by changing how space is used. Frontal area is more costly to use that length, so so smarter use of say where batteries are relative to feet, can give the feel of more depth while not adding to the frontal area.
I agree, there can still be improvements in many areas. I would say ditch this whole discussion and argue that personal vehicles shouldn’t be the primary option and the focus should be on more efficient and effective public transport instead. But on the personal vehicle side, the practical first step is phasing out ICE vehicles, which brings a huge overall improvement to transport efficiency as it stands. The second step would then be making the least efficient EVs more efficient. EV development and design can still progress during that time, but millions of km of roadway is constructed based on this standard shape of vehicle. If you want more efficient than the I6 and M3, I’d say get an electric motorcycle.
I don’t like this line of thinking because the resources required to replace every car we have with an electric one (and if things continue as is, they’ll also be bigger). We need to have way fewer cars. Our personal vehicles should be in the shape of bicycles.
…which is why I said we should “ditch this whole discussion and argue that personal vehicles shouldn’t be the primary option and the focus should be on more efficient and effective public transport instead.”
Unfortunately, much of North America was developed to be reliant on personal vehicles. I love to bike when I can, but development needs to change to make it a practical form of transport for most trips.
I wasn’t sure where you were going with the “I would say…” part, so I thought it was worth saying.
And to that I would point out that much of North America was redeveloped for the car, since most cities were once walkable and had great public transport networks. It was redeveloped once so it can be redeveloped again.
I don’t disagree, but I don’t think that type of redevelopment will be nearly as quick as we need it to be.